Fwd: Re: inventory of public address data for geocoding in Europe

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Fwd: Re: inventory of public address data for geocoding in Europe

Moritz Lennert
[this was supposed to go to the list as well]

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [Geodata] inventory of public address data for geocoding in
Europe
Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 11:25:29 +0100
From: Moritz Lennert <[hidden email]>
To: Milo van der Linden <[hidden email]>

Hello Milo,

On 13/03/13 11:39, Milo van der Linden wrote:
> Hello Moritz,
>
> Geodata Discovery and geocoding are two different things.On the OSGeo
> wiki there is an (outdated) page on opengeocoder.
> http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/OpenGeocoder maybe that can be a starting
> point for you?

I am aware of the difference. However, geocoding might just be one use
of address data, so I thought that an inventory of such data might be
more for the geodata group. But if you tell me that this is not the
case, then I'll go look elsewhere.

> About the services you mention: I am currently in the process of
> importing BAG address data into OpenStreetMap, particulary for the
> nominatim geocoding service
> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Nominatim

Great !

I was wondering about the licence of the BAG address data. I haven't
been able to find the info. Via your site (http://www.nlextract.nl/), I
found the INSPIRE download service:
http://geodata.nationaalgeoregister.nl/inspireadressen/atom/inspireadressen.xml,

but again, I haven't been able to find license info in the data set either.


> Perhaps OpenStreetMap might be a good place to hold global address
> data? I think it might. But of course other ideas are most welcome!

At this stage, I'm not looking for a place to put the actual data. I
just want to make an inventory of where in Europe such data is available
and under which conditions...

But I agree that OSM would be the perfect place to make the data available.

>
> Good luck on your project and good to see you are addressing the
> addressing issue ;-)

Thanks !

Moritz

>
> 2013/3/13 Moritz Lennert<[hidden email]>:
>> Hello,
>>
>> I'm hoping to be able to revive this list a bit with a specific project: In
>> the context of my research, I'm currently trying to compile an inventory of
>> public open address data usable for geocoding (or possibly publicly
>> accessible geocoding services). At this stage I have already come upon the
>> following data sources:
>>
>> Spain: CartoCiudad
>> France: BD Adresses and the PointsAdresses from IGN France
>> Netherlands: BAG Compact from the Dutch Cadaster
>> Belgium: The Geodatabases from the three Belgian regions (UrBIS, PLI and
>> AGIV)
>> - Great Britain: Code-Point from the Ordnance Survey (not address, but
>> postcodes which are very dense in GB)
>>
>> The output could be a list of such data on [1], but should also lead to a
>> publication providing other research teams with the information and an
>> evaluation of the possibilities of geocoding based on public, open data in
>> Europe today.
>>
>> Several questions:
>>
>> - Should/can I start a table on [1] ? Is there a better place ?
>> - Does anyone have knowledge of similar data sets in other European
>> countries ?
>> - Does anyone have knowledge of already existing inventories on such data ?
>>
>> Any feedback is more than welcome !
>>
>> Moritz
>>
>>
>>
>> [1] http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Geodata_Discovery_Working_Group
>> _______________________________________________
>> Geodata mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/geodata



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Re: Fwd: Re: inventory of public address data for geocoding in Europe

Arnulf Christl-3
Hi,
interesting thread, please keep it coming.

Wrt dumping the data into OSM, this is good - but also raises quite a
few interesting questions about how to maintain the data in the long
run. Bulk uploads are great but so far we have not really developed any
strategies going beyond hunting-gathering. This is why for now I am
still more of a proponent of federated access. Leave the data where it
is and make it directly accessible. At least until we have a viable and
automized way of updating this kind of data. Getting there will need a
lot of thinking and also organizational changes. Honestly, most Open
Data still looks and feels like it fell off the back of a truck and next
time you look there it's gone. Not a good basis for coherent maintenance
- and lots of work for the likes of us.

Cheers,
Arnulf

On 14.03.2013 11:25, Moritz Lennert wrote:

> [this was supposed to go to the list as well]
>
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: Re: [Geodata] inventory of public address data for geocoding in
> Europe
> Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 11:25:29 +0100
> From: Moritz Lennert <[hidden email]>
> To: Milo van der Linden <[hidden email]>
>
> Hello Milo,
>
> On 13/03/13 11:39, Milo van der Linden wrote:
>> Hello Moritz,
>>
>> Geodata Discovery and geocoding are two different things.On the OSGeo
>> wiki there is an (outdated) page on opengeocoder.
>> http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/OpenGeocoder maybe that can be a starting
>> point for you?
>
> I am aware of the difference. However, geocoding might just be one use
> of address data, so I thought that an inventory of such data might be
> more for the geodata group. But if you tell me that this is not the
> case, then I'll go look elsewhere.
>
>> About the services you mention: I am currently in the process of
>> importing BAG address data into OpenStreetMap, particulary for the
>> nominatim geocoding service
>> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Nominatim
>
> Great !
>
> I was wondering about the licence of the BAG address data. I haven't
> been able to find the info. Via your site (http://www.nlextract.nl/), I
> found the INSPIRE download service:
> http://geodata.nationaalgeoregister.nl/inspireadressen/atom/inspireadressen.xml,
>
> but again, I haven't been able to find license info in the data set either.
>
>
>> Perhaps OpenStreetMap might be a good place to hold global address
>> data? I think it might. But of course other ideas are most welcome!
>
> At this stage, I'm not looking for a place to put the actual data. I
> just want to make an inventory of where in Europe such data is available
> and under which conditions...
>
> But I agree that OSM would be the perfect place to make the data available.
>
>>
>> Good luck on your project and good to see you are addressing the
>> addressing issue ;-)
>
> Thanks !
>
> Moritz
>
>>
>> 2013/3/13 Moritz Lennert<[hidden email]>:
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> I'm hoping to be able to revive this list a bit with a specific
>>> project: In
>>> the context of my research, I'm currently trying to compile an
>>> inventory of
>>> public open address data usable for geocoding (or possibly publicly
>>> accessible geocoding services). At this stage I have already come
>>> upon the
>>> following data sources:
>>>
>>> Spain: CartoCiudad
>>> France: BD Adresses and the PointsAdresses from IGN France
>>> Netherlands: BAG Compact from the Dutch Cadaster
>>> Belgium: The Geodatabases from the three Belgian regions (UrBIS, PLI and
>>> AGIV)
>>> - Great Britain: Code-Point from the Ordnance Survey (not address, but
>>> postcodes which are very dense in GB)
>>>
>>> The output could be a list of such data on [1], but should also lead
>>> to a
>>> publication providing other research teams with the information and an
>>> evaluation of the possibilities of geocoding based on public, open
>>> data in
>>> Europe today.
>>>
>>> Several questions:
>>>
>>> - Should/can I start a table on [1] ? Is there a better place ?
>>> - Does anyone have knowledge of similar data sets in other European
>>> countries ?
>>> - Does anyone have knowledge of already existing inventories on such
>>> data ?
>>>
>>> Any feedback is more than welcome !
>>>
>>> Moritz
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> [1] http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Geodata_Discovery_Working_Group
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Geodata mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/geodata
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Geodata mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/geodata


--
Arnulf Christl (President)
http://www.metaspatial.net
Your Spatial Data Services

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Re: Fwd: Re: inventory of public address data for geocoding in Europe

Andy Turner
In reply to this post by Moritz Lennert
In the UK the Office For National Statistics (ONS) now release a postcode directory look up (ONSPD). This allows for postcodes to be located to a point in a projection and coordinate system. It also provides look ups to various administrative and census area. This data is released under the UK Open Government license and can currently be found via the following URL:
http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/guide-method/geography/products/postcode-directories/-nspp-/index.html

I think there is a consultation at the moment about releasing address point data under the same license in the UK.

HTH

Andy
http://www.geog.leeds.ac.uk/people/a.turner/
 

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Moritz Lennert
Sent: 14 March 2013 10:26
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [Geodata] Fwd: Re: inventory of public address data for geocoding in Europe

[this was supposed to go to the list as well]

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [Geodata] inventory of public address data for geocoding in
Europe
Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 11:25:29 +0100
From: Moritz Lennert <[hidden email]>
To: Milo van der Linden <[hidden email]>

Hello Milo,

On 13/03/13 11:39, Milo van der Linden wrote:
> Hello Moritz,
>
> Geodata Discovery and geocoding are two different things.On the OSGeo
> wiki there is an (outdated) page on opengeocoder.
> http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/OpenGeocoder maybe that can be a starting
> point for you?

I am aware of the difference. However, geocoding might just be one use
of address data, so I thought that an inventory of such data might be
more for the geodata group. But if you tell me that this is not the
case, then I'll go look elsewhere.

> About the services you mention: I am currently in the process of
> importing BAG address data into OpenStreetMap, particulary for the
> nominatim geocoding service
> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Nominatim

Great !

I was wondering about the licence of the BAG address data. I haven't
been able to find the info. Via your site (http://www.nlextract.nl/), I
found the INSPIRE download service:
http://geodata.nationaalgeoregister.nl/inspireadressen/atom/inspireadressen.xml,

but again, I haven't been able to find license info in the data set either.


> Perhaps OpenStreetMap might be a good place to hold global address
> data? I think it might. But of course other ideas are most welcome!

At this stage, I'm not looking for a place to put the actual data. I
just want to make an inventory of where in Europe such data is available
and under which conditions...

But I agree that OSM would be the perfect place to make the data available.

>
> Good luck on your project and good to see you are addressing the
> addressing issue ;-)

Thanks !

Moritz

>
> 2013/3/13 Moritz Lennert<[hidden email]>:
>> Hello,
>>
>> I'm hoping to be able to revive this list a bit with a specific project: In
>> the context of my research, I'm currently trying to compile an inventory of
>> public open address data usable for geocoding (or possibly publicly
>> accessible geocoding services). At this stage I have already come upon the
>> following data sources:
>>
>> Spain: CartoCiudad
>> France: BD Adresses and the PointsAdresses from IGN France
>> Netherlands: BAG Compact from the Dutch Cadaster
>> Belgium: The Geodatabases from the three Belgian regions (UrBIS, PLI and
>> AGIV)
>> - Great Britain: Code-Point from the Ordnance Survey (not address, but
>> postcodes which are very dense in GB)
>>
>> The output could be a list of such data on [1], but should also lead to a
>> publication providing other research teams with the information and an
>> evaluation of the possibilities of geocoding based on public, open data in
>> Europe today.
>>
>> Several questions:
>>
>> - Should/can I start a table on [1] ? Is there a better place ?
>> - Does anyone have knowledge of similar data sets in other European
>> countries ?
>> - Does anyone have knowledge of already existing inventories on such data ?
>>
>> Any feedback is more than welcome !
>>
>> Moritz
>>
>>
>>
>> [1] http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Geodata_Discovery_Working_Group
>> _______________________________________________
>> Geodata mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/geodata



_______________________________________________
Geodata mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/geodata
_______________________________________________
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Re: Fwd: Re: inventory of public address data for geocoding in Europe

Moritz Lennert
Andy,

Thanks for your response.

On 14/03/13 12:49, Andy Turner wrote:
> In the UK the Office For National Statistics (ONS) now release a
> postcode directory look up (ONSPD). This allows for postcodes to be
> located to a point in a projection and coordinate system. It also
> provides look ups to various administrative and census area. This
> data is released under the UK Open Government license and can
> currently be found via the following URL:
> http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/guide-method/geography/products/postcode-directories/-nspp-/index.html

Thank you for the hint. If I understand correctly, the aim of the above
is to create a "spatial hierarchy" of units that allows to construct
data in larger units (output areas, administrative, health, etc) from
the postcodes.

Concerning coordinates for postcodes, the Code-Point Open data from the
Ordnance Survey provides those [1].

I'll have to check how the NSPL data at your above link compares to the
Code-Point Open data.


>
>  I think there is a consultation at the moment about releasing
> address point data under the same license in the UK.

This would be great !

Moritz

[1] http://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/oswebsite/products/code-point-open/

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Re: Fwd: Re: inventory of public address data for geocoding in Europe

Andy Turner
Thank Moritz.

I'm not sure what the state of the consultation on the address data is. Here is a good link to some further information:
http://data.gov.uk/blog/odug-calls-on-the-government-to-deliver-an-open-national-address-dataset-under-the-open-government-l

The ONSPD data that is available via one of the links I sent is a 2013 data resource. I reckon it was released partly as a consequence of the making open data real consultation (https://www.gov.uk/government/consultations/making-open-data-real)

UK postcodes change over time, but not massively. How different the ONSPD 2013 data is from the Ordnance Survey data I don't know. A UK postcode rather than being an area/region is a set of delivery points. Areas/regions can be derived from these. I'm not sure about the ownership of all the address data, but I know that there is some data about organisations that link to their addresses that is far from open data, for example, the Business Structure Database (http://www.esds.ac.uk/findingData/snDescription.asp?sn=6697). That data is strictly controlled and from what I understand, it is sort of like companies house data and open corporate data, but perhaps more detailed and enriched, though certainly just for UK.

HTH

Andy
http://www.geog.leeds.ac.uk/people/a.turner/
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Moritz Lennert [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: 15 March 2013 13:58
To: Andy Turner
Cc: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Geodata] Fwd: Re: inventory of public address data for geocoding in Europe

Andy,

Thanks for your response.

On 14/03/13 12:49, Andy Turner wrote:
> In the UK the Office For National Statistics (ONS) now release a
> postcode directory look up (ONSPD). This allows for postcodes to be
> located to a point in a projection and coordinate system. It also
> provides look ups to various administrative and census area. This
> data is released under the UK Open Government license and can
> currently be found via the following URL:
> http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/guide-method/geography/products/postcode-directories/-nspp-/index.html

Thank you for the hint. If I understand correctly, the aim of the above
is to create a "spatial hierarchy" of units that allows to construct
data in larger units (output areas, administrative, health, etc) from
the postcodes.

Concerning coordinates for postcodes, the Code-Point Open data from the
Ordnance Survey provides those [1].

I'll have to check how the NSPL data at your above link compares to the
Code-Point Open data.


>
>  I think there is a consultation at the moment about releasing
> address point data under the same license in the UK.

This would be great !

Moritz

[1] http://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/oswebsite/products/code-point-open/

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